One in four?
That’s piss poor performance compared to Scandinavia. Norway is basically at 100% now with 98%!
In Denmark 97% of private registered cars were electric, but including businesses it drops to 80%.
IDK why businesses are so far behind? Businesses are usually very busy claiming to be green?
Finland and Sweden trail behind with only 47 and 43%.
So IMO one in four means that just about everybody else is way way behind. 🙁
I just charged today at €0,11 per kWh, my VW ID.4 drives about 5.3 km pr. kWh, that’s about 19 kWh per 100 km. = € 2.09.
With an ICE car driving 24 km/l with gas being around €2,30 here, that’s 100/24*2,3 = € 9,60.
So your tiny economic Peugeot 107 is more than 4,5 times as expensive to drive in fuel.
Admittedly I charge cheap, because it’s surplus power from solar panels, so it’s only the price I could have sold the power for instead of charging my car. But even without that I could buy the power at € 0,16, and it is often cheaper if you buy when the price is low.
Many workplaces also have charging stations where you can charge for free.
A BEV is way cheaper to drive than ICE. Even 24 km/l is no competition, it isn’t even close. Even when you have to buy power at normal prices.
If you use fast charging stations it’s a bit more expensive, but you should only do that on long trips, and it is still cheaper than driving an ICE car.
But yes a 2008 Peugeot 107 is dirt cheap to buy, but at that age it probably also requires some maintenance. Here it would be very difficult to find one that is that old and still legal to drive. Most cars here only last about 13-14 years, unless they get renewed rust protection, which only last 2 years and cost nearly 1000 Euro to get. So not really an option for an 18 year old cheap car.
My guess is you live under weather conditions that allow cars to last longer.
Entry level ID.4 goes for 35k€. It’s not a cheap transport. There are BEV for less but then you are limited by range for only your day to day stuff. Modern ICE is not great either, very complex so its basically a ticking time bomb for maintenance. Ahh
OK I thought gas prices in Italy were higher than here, I wish we could have cars that could last 18 years here, without having to spend 1000 Euro every second year on rust protection.
Regarding charging prices, I have 2 neighbors who pay 100 Euro per month, and then they can charge all they want.
One of them drive 300 km every workday of the month. that’s 6000 km!! So that’s less than 0,02 Euro per km. in charging cost. 🤣
He even got his home charger cheap because of that agreement, and the charge on the home charger is included in the 100 Euro.
Needless to say his savings compared to an ICE car are insane. If I remember correctly, he said he used 1000+ Euro on gas when he drove an ICE car.
Of course he also drives an expensive BMW, because there are tax deductions for having long transport to work. 😋
On the other hand he spends 3 hours per day driving to work.
The other neighbor has about half that, but it’s still an insanely good deal. The savings in gas are enough to finance all costs of the car.
I just checked the portal for electricity offers here, it’s something I do every year to compare with what I have. I selected 2800kWh as annual consumption with a contract power of 4.5kW
The starting price of the best offer today is 900€/y
That’s insane, I have no idea what contract power of 4,5 kW is, but 2800/900 is 3.11 Euro per kWh.
That’s absolutely insane! Here a kWh cost 0,49 Euro at a 400 KWh charging station!
Just driving in to charge without any subscription.
But you must have made some sort of mistake, there is no way a kWh can cost that much.
Also it sounds like it’s electricity for your house and not for charging cars, since you write you check every year and you don’t have an electric car?
The example I gave is only for charging cars. So many choose it for convenience, but don’t drive nearly as much.
But when you drive a lot, it’s an insanely good deal.
The reason is probably that electric cars are heavily subsidized in Denmark (via much lower vehicle registration tax) and those subsidies are lower for businesses.
Subsidies for electric cars were removed in Sweden a few years ago, so I would say 43% electric sales (and rising) is very impressive.
Yes I am left wing myself, but goddam Scholz was a disappointment.
Maybe AfD can wake people up to the importance of electing politicians that actually work for the people, and not for special interests. Hate and bigotry (AfD) and the 1% (CDU) have a tendency to meet.
Best of luck to you down there in Germany, it could definitely be better.
Nordic and Benelux markets remained Europe’s most electrified, led by Denmark at 80.1%, followed by Finland (52.6%), the Netherlands (47.3%), Belgium (42.8%) and Sweden (42.6%).
A 30% increase year on year is nothing to be sniffed at. There is substantial growth. I agree it needs to be better and faster, but still, it’s good.
It’s just weird coming from Denmark with 80% that 1 in 4 is the average, meaning half the countries are probably below that?
But I guess it has to do with electric cars still being more expensive to buy, even though they are way cheaper afterwards both to charge than to buy gasoline, and in repairs.
It comes down to infrastructure more than anything. I’m guessing eastern EU countries haven’t invested as heavily as western countries. From the article, it sounds like anything Italy and east has minimal EV uptake. Doesn’t matter if it’s cheaper if there is nowhere to charge, or get the car serviced.
Yes that is true, but drivers also need breaks, so I would think it would be mostly an issue of just planning to charge during a break.
That may not always be possible. But for by far the most jobs, a decent EV has enough range to be able to last an entire workday.
And for instance here even cabs are electric since some time now. And they drive all the time except breaks. But if you have a cab with 800 km range, and you drive 50 km/h in the city, the cab has more than enough juice to last an entire 8 hour shift. It’s actually 16 hours, and with slow traffic and pausing for traffic lights, I bet it can last a whole day including night.
If it’s good enough for a taxi company, it should be good enough for almost all purposes.
If cars are used that heavily, they are probably also cleaned regularly, my guess is when handing it over to the next driver. So I don’t think any car is truly 24/7.
There are various breaks that can be used to charge the cars if you plan ahead.
My point was just to say that the economics aren’t always clear cut. There is also depreciation, fleet maintenance, capacity to handle charging, and all other sorts.
One in four?
That’s piss poor performance compared to Scandinavia. Norway is basically at 100% now with 98%!
In Denmark 97% of private registered cars were electric, but including businesses it drops to 80%.
IDK why businesses are so far behind? Businesses are usually very busy claiming to be green?
Finland and Sweden trail behind with only 47 and 43%.
So IMO one in four means that just about everybody else is way way behind. 🙁
They cost an arm and a leg, still not comparable in terms of range, price of electric recharge is crazy very often
Today if I had to change my Peugeot 107 from 2008, I would go for another Peugeot 107 from 2000something with less km
I can do 24km per liter, pay 2k maintenance per year
It moves me from A to B.
I just charged today at €0,11 per kWh, my VW ID.4 drives about 5.3 km pr. kWh, that’s about 19 kWh per 100 km. = € 2.09.
With an ICE car driving 24 km/l with gas being around €2,30 here, that’s 100/24*2,3 = € 9,60.
So your tiny economic Peugeot 107 is more than 4,5 times as expensive to drive in fuel.
Admittedly I charge cheap, because it’s surplus power from solar panels, so it’s only the price I could have sold the power for instead of charging my car. But even without that I could buy the power at € 0,16, and it is often cheaper if you buy when the price is low.
Many workplaces also have charging stations where you can charge for free.
A BEV is way cheaper to drive than ICE. Even 24 km/l is no competition, it isn’t even close. Even when you have to buy power at normal prices.
If you use fast charging stations it’s a bit more expensive, but you should only do that on long trips, and it is still cheaper than driving an ICE car.
But yes a 2008 Peugeot 107 is dirt cheap to buy, but at that age it probably also requires some maintenance. Here it would be very difficult to find one that is that old and still legal to drive. Most cars here only last about 13-14 years, unless they get renewed rust protection, which only last 2 years and cost nearly 1000 Euro to get. So not really an option for an 18 year old cheap car.
My guess is you live under weather conditions that allow cars to last longer.
Edit: A miscalculation and some typos.
Entry level ID.4 goes for 35k€. It’s not a cheap transport. There are BEV for less but then you are limited by range for only your day to day stuff. Modern ICE is not great either, very complex so its basically a ticking time bomb for maintenance. Ahh
Yeah, no sea here and neither super cold. Try to check the cost of a charging station in Italy.
Here you either have solar or you can charge for free at work, because the price of charging around is very expensive (not gas expensive but still)
Where I live, from January to today, my average gas price is 1,80 € per liter btw, now the price per liter is touching 2€
OK I thought gas prices in Italy were higher than here, I wish we could have cars that could last 18 years here, without having to spend 1000 Euro every second year on rust protection.
Regarding charging prices, I have 2 neighbors who pay 100 Euro per month, and then they can charge all they want.
One of them drive 300 km every workday of the month. that’s 6000 km!! So that’s less than 0,02 Euro per km. in charging cost. 🤣
He even got his home charger cheap because of that agreement, and the charge on the home charger is included in the 100 Euro.
Needless to say his savings compared to an ICE car are insane. If I remember correctly, he said he used 1000+ Euro on gas when he drove an ICE car.
Of course he also drives an expensive BMW, because there are tax deductions for having long transport to work. 😋
On the other hand he spends 3 hours per day driving to work.
The other neighbor has about half that, but it’s still an insanely good deal. The savings in gas are enough to finance all costs of the car.
I just checked the portal for electricity offers here, it’s something I do every year to compare with what I have. I selected 2800kWh as annual consumption with a contract power of 4.5kW The starting price of the best offer today is 900€/y
That’s insane, I have no idea what contract power of 4,5 kW is, but 2800/900 is 3.11 Euro per kWh.
That’s absolutely insane! Here a kWh cost 0,49 Euro at a 400 KWh charging station!
Just driving in to charge without any subscription.
But you must have made some sort of mistake, there is no way a kWh can cost that much.
Also it sounds like it’s electricity for your house and not for charging cars, since you write you check every year and you don’t have an electric car?
The example I gave is only for charging cars. So many choose it for convenience, but don’t drive nearly as much.
But when you drive a lot, it’s an insanely good deal.
Yeah that’s a house contract
4.5kW is the max drawing power, after that it jumps and cuts it.
In Italy the only way to charge for cheap is using solar from your house
I checked out of curiosity and the best contract if you consume a lot is 0.38€/kWh for the first 320kWH (and then you get a shitty deal)
Average goes for 0.60€/kWh but the included quantity gets lower.
Normally it goes for 0.7-0.8 for consumption (not flat contracts)
Often those are not very fast charging, and if you let your car connected for more than 1h or 2h (depends) you get overcharged per minute of occupancy
The reason is probably that electric cars are heavily subsidized in Denmark (via much lower vehicle registration tax) and those subsidies are lower for businesses.
Subsidies for electric cars were removed in Sweden a few years ago, so I would say 43% electric sales (and rising) is very impressive.
Yes in the form that they pay lower tax on ICE maybe.
Well yeah, scandinavian countries have the advantage of having decent governments, unlike germany lol
Yes I am left wing myself, but goddam Scholz was a disappointment.
Maybe AfD can wake people up to the importance of electing politicians that actually work for the people, and not for special interests. Hate and bigotry (AfD) and the 1% (CDU) have a tendency to meet.
Best of luck to you down there in Germany, it could definitely be better.
A 30% increase year on year is nothing to be sniffed at. There is substantial growth. I agree it needs to be better and faster, but still, it’s good.
It’s just weird coming from Denmark with 80% that 1 in 4 is the average, meaning half the countries are probably below that?
But I guess it has to do with electric cars still being more expensive to buy, even though they are way cheaper afterwards both to charge than to buy gasoline, and in repairs.
It comes down to infrastructure more than anything. I’m guessing eastern EU countries haven’t invested as heavily as western countries. From the article, it sounds like anything Italy and east has minimal EV uptake. Doesn’t matter if it’s cheaper if there is nowhere to charge, or get the car serviced.
Businesses need range and turnaround time. Sometimes 24/7. An hour on the charger is an hour not making money.
Yes that is true, but drivers also need breaks, so I would think it would be mostly an issue of just planning to charge during a break.
That may not always be possible. But for by far the most jobs, a decent EV has enough range to be able to last an entire workday.
And for instance here even cabs are electric since some time now. And they drive all the time except breaks. But if you have a cab with 800 km range, and you drive 50 km/h in the city, the cab has more than enough juice to last an entire 8 hour shift. It’s actually 16 hours, and with slow traffic and pausing for traffic lights, I bet it can last a whole day including night.
If it’s good enough for a taxi company, it should be good enough for almost all purposes.
If cars are used that heavily, they are probably also cleaned regularly, my guess is when handing it over to the next driver. So I don’t think any car is truly 24/7.
There are various breaks that can be used to charge the cars if you plan ahead.
You don’t have to tell me, I’m in Scandinavia. All cars are electric around me. Cabs and trucks and all.
Ah so I’m basically talking to myself here. 😋
My point was just to say that the economics aren’t always clear cut. There is also depreciation, fleet maintenance, capacity to handle charging, and all other sorts.